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Author
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Topic: advice, encouragement for court stuff
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sandra Member
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posted 09-20-2006 02:00 PM
court is coming up next week...I am very angry and outraged about soemthing....the school my child went to last year, she was ill and missed 2 weeks- which many children do all the time, she never had attendance problem before. The prinipcal gave me a hard time about it and did some really weird things. I gave him teh doctor note, but he said he 'wanted to see her so HE could 'confirm' the diagnosis!!!" I was shocked and thought is this guy for real??? I pointed out, uh, that's the dr note, she is the one who 'treats' her, and if you have a question call her. He continued to act as if I did something wrong, he went so far as to ask me if he could 'hop in my car and come home with me' after a meeting, and see her so that he could 'verify' or confirm the diagnosis!! I honestly was not prepared for such a request and waited for him to say 'just kidding' but he was serious. When i told him I didnt want him to come home with me, he acted very insulted and became quiet, later saying 'i dont know why you wouldnt want to do that/' after that, he was very adversarial towards me. There was another education meeting in summer for her, and I asked that he schedule a different time, as I could not make that time. He absolutely refused to do so, and told me that he "could not reschedule, because he had already scheduled"-- huh?? A family member talked with him and he told them that he would not reschedule. I had to talk with a person higher up and they apologized and told me that it should be scheduled at a mutual time for the parent to attend, and they rescheduled it for him. Later on during summer my ex who is not custodial parent told me the principal had talked to him privately, I wondered why would the principal be calling him, during summer, seems very suspicious, he knows for one thing that he isnt custodial parent. The last thing was when I found out he did t hat, I dropped off the custody order at his office requesting he only discuss matters with myself, not other people. He called and said he would not honor the court order, because there was a bit of white out on it, (a small bit of non relevant information was whited out, however everything he needed to see was very clear)....I had somebody drop off another paper wihtout whiteout on it,...and they requested that he send written confirmation he had it, and understood it's content. That was 3 weeks ago and he flat refuses to do so.After reading this, what is your perception? Does it sound like he was 'hitting' on me by asking to come in my car with me, and when I declined he was insulted and that's why he's discrminated against me? does it sound like maybe he has issues with women who are custodial parent ( i am pretty sure he's not married but he does have a child....is this some issue from his own past, that makes it a bit too personal for him??) I would like to see what your impression is of his behavior and then I will write what the main concern is. I did write a letter of complaint to the district |
JAYJAY Member
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posted 09-20-2006 03:34 PM
Hi Sandra,When reading your topic i felt very uneasy, first i thought maybe he was hitting on you, then i wondered if he knows your ex and they are up to something. Has he said anything to your daughter? She may have said something that he has taken the wrong way. Over here they jump on anything and sometimes take it the wrong way. I would go and see him again and then ask him out straight what is going on and if you dont get any joy go over his head. I hope things sort themselfs out soon. -x-x- |
motwgk Member
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posted 09-20-2006 03:39 PM
It is of course impossible for us to know what his intentions were, not having been there. So I don't want this reply to sound like I'm not taking your accusation seriously. Only you can really answer that part of your question.So here's a few things to consider. When it comes to parenting plans, in my school district, they physically have to see a certified copy of the parenting plan, seal and all. They make a copy of it, initial it and put it in their "book". Seeing a copy of a certified copy would not work in my district. If they can't see and feel the seal, it doesn't count. And they managed to lose mine twice. I finally had to take in the certified copy, meet with the principal, the head admin, and the teacher at the same time to get it right. Second, in my state, both parents have equal access to school records. It may be that your ex has either contacted the school, or been contacted by the school, having to do with something that he's required to be notified about. It doesn't have anything to do with custodial status. Third, again in my school district, if a child misses more than x number of days, the state gets involved. This is to protect the child from parents who don't regard school as important. I say this only because it's the law, and they're required to do certain actions. Not implying you'd let your child miss school on purpose. I don't have the school handbook in front of me, but state law requires the school to notify officials. All this said, his actions sound odd. First, because he should be willing to schedule meetings *with* you, and not *for* you. Second, because I can't think of an education professional who should visit your house. If there were an issue with the number of days missed, it would be local authorities who would visit your house, not a school official. (And again, all of this is hypothetical.) I don't think you'd be out of line to suggest to the school officials that if he can't reschedule a meeting for you, that he'd need to schedule it for you and your attorney. Or that if he wants to come visit you at your house, you'd be happy to do that when your attorney could be there. I think that if you suddenly started throwing around the phrase "my attorney", that things might improve. A bluff, but possibly an effective one. You might also send it to him at the school again, registered and certified mail. A cost, but at least you could verify that he had it. Or possible arrange to drop it off at the district level, talk with them and have them get the information to the school. If the district seems more cooperative, ask for a meeting between them, the principal and yourself. Stay calm, and realize that you have the court order on your side. Working with the district will let him know that he can't push you around and push your buttons - you have rights.
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mommyof2 Member
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posted 09-20-2006 04:16 PM
It could be a number of things which would all be speculations being that we have no concrete evidence stating what his motives are. There is a good possibility that he was notified by either your ex expressing his concerns or by your daughter’s appointed attorney that have raised some red flags that have allowed him to feel you cannot be trusted thus wanting proof of your child’s illness. I must say that his approach was unethical and are grounds for further investigation by the school district. I would also insist that you have a 3rd party when meeting with him. He cannot under any circumstances refuse to abide by the court documents. That alone can be grounds for further investigation.Sandra I have to be honest with you chances is you daughter fears and anxiety attacks may be a reaction to all the animosity that she is sensing between you and your ex. If she is taking medication you may want to look into possible side effect which may include paranoia, hallucinations, and anything else in that category. When my daughter was on a particular med she was hearing voices and seeing things that were not there. It’s important for the sake of you and your daughter’s well being to not allow all the court procedures, ex drama, money problems, and any thing else that might be stressing you to get the best of you, remain calm and in control at all times. My brother once told me Lisa’ we all know what a damn good mother you are to your kids, but if you go into the court room with your emotions you are going to lose. A judge wants to see a parent who is in complete control even under such stressful circumstances. Once I allowed myself to not react to any of my ex’s head games I started to feel better about myself and who I was as a woman, mother, and individual with rights. From what I have read thus far, you are a good mother who is only looking out for the best interest of her daughter. The only thing I would change is your way of viewing things. You cannot change your sister, your ex, or anyone else for that matter. You have to learn to cut ties that are toxic to you and your daughter even if it means no more holidays with the family. I think your daughter has endured enough stress in her life she do not need an unsupportive and uncaring aunt making her feel unloved or unimportant. Please take all this out of love and concern for you and your daughter. motwgk I just read your reply -- well said. [This message has been edited by mommyof2 (edited 09-20-2006).] |
sandra Member
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posted 09-20-2006 09:54 PM
the thing about her (not that long) absence though, was that it was excused by the doctor--- there was an actual, written doctor note, the standard note any parent brings after an absence of 2 or 3 days. THe principal would not accept the doctor's note- which I do not believe it is up to a principal to somehow second guess a doctor.
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sandra Member
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posted 09-20-2006 10:21 PM
Okay, here is the really weird thing about all this. As I said my ex and me like many divorced couples have court from time to time. Very recently my ex told me that he had 'gotten' the principal to agree to come to court for him, to be a witness against me!!!! I am going to find out soon if that's true, but if is, this is totally outrageous behavior. How can a principal of a school with 1,000 students take time out from his duties to run down to court to help out another ex-husband?? I thought school personnel were supposed to be totally unbiased and stay out of personal things like a custody hearing. What really concerns me with taht though is this principal would be making things up about me, since there is nothing to tell...what reason would be sufficient for him to drop 1,000 kids at his school and run down to court for a day?? Just to tell the judge she was absent? Big deal, there was a doctor note. It worries me bc he treated me so oddly before, i haven't written all the weird stuff he did, but it all started after he asked if he could come to my house and I said sorry, I guess not,...he took personal offense at that and had it in for me since then. He tried to intimidate me, he even threatened me saying that he had a right to come to my house to 'confirm' the diagnosis, and during summer my ex told me he had talked to him. That seems strange due to the fact that he ONLY talked to my ex, .....isnt the school supposed to mainly communicate w/ the custodial parent? Knowing a custody thing was coming up, it seems too coincidental that they had been talking--- it seems like it would be breaking school policy for him to run to court to take my ex's side. That doesnt have to do with his school, afterall, and besides she doesnt even go there anymore. What are your thoughts on this? I remember my attorney saying last year how alot of times it's really hard to get people to agree to come to court to be a witness, even if it's for a very important matter, like a witness to a murder even, they often won't want to come, and they have to be subpoenaed. So....for a principal with 1,000 students, to volunteer to drop work for a day, run all teh way to court, and spend a good half a day or more there, (on taxpayer money??) just to take sides with a parent over another parent, and the child doesnt even go to his school anymore?> what should I do, or maybe i should ask what would you do if that were you? what is even more odd is that the school she used to go to said that they would not even allow a teacher to write a basic character reference for me to take to court, because they dont like to get involved in that. So, 2 schools from the same district. One school says they will not even write a basic neutral character reference and the other school's principal will actually GO to court, to openly testify for one parent against the other? this doesnt make sense at all... |
sandra Member
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posted 09-21-2006 08:52 AM
if it is true that he wants to run to court for my ex husband, does that sound illegal or out of school policy?? I can't imagine schools allowing personnel to drop their (tax payer funded) duties (he has 1,000 kids to oversee for crying out loud, and how many teachers, and other school business) I can't imagine the district approving him to drop that, to on the tax payer bill, live out his own agenda in family court for my ex. The thing that makes that obvious it is personal for him, is that most times, even for something very serious, people dont want to testify in court...so to come to court because she was absent for a short time, and there was a doctor note? It's just so obvious it's personal for him. Is there something I can do?? He is messing with my daughter's life, she only went to his school for a year and 3 months, and doesnt go there anymore. Her whole school career she's had almost perfect attendance and he knows that....it was a short time at the end of the year, adn doctor note provided. He cannot take up one parents cause against another, can he? that would not be neutral, and as I said, if schools allowed that, there would be no end to requests for teachers, administrators to talk down about other parent in court, they would never get around to school business. At the other school in the district they said they won't get involved in anything court related...that's how I dont understand how this guy's in the same district, for him to be that personally involved. |
mommyof2 Member
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posted 09-21-2006 10:57 AM
Word of advice -- Don’t believe everything your ex says. This principal is not going to court and speaking on your ex’s behalf. What he is trying to do is rile you up in the hope that you will back off, thus him winning. You see for him it’s about winning, not what is in the best interest of his daughter. It’s a power game. The principal knows very well that if he was to go to court to speak on either parent’s behalf that he could lose his job. I highly doubt he is going to put his job on the line. If your child does not go to that school then why are you still in contact with that principal? By trying to get the new school involved you are making things worse than what they are. As long as you present yourself in a respectful manner, attend all school meetings and functions, and are actively involved in your child’s life then there is no reason you would have to go out of your way to prove yourself. As the old saying goes actions speak louder than words. Stop allowing your ex to control your emotions; he is going to end up making you a nervous wreck. Believe me I know what I speak of. |
sandra Member
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posted 09-21-2006 12:05 PM
mommyof2,i know 99% of the time a principal would not run down to court to take sides with a parent. BUT, becuse of his very unusual and biased actions towards me before, and even recently, it fits with how this person is. For example, at end of year after she was absent I gave him the dr. note, and asked he excuse her absence. Do you know what he told me? Okay, I will mark it off? Anyone would think so. No, he told me that attendance is something that is ongoing in any students' career, and he 'could not say either way' if it was excused or not, regardeless of doctor note. I asked him why not, that's what parents alwasy do, bring a doctor note, he said that if he excused her absence it would be 'like excusing future absences'. I told him I am not asking you to 'excuse future absence' (this is impossible anyways, I could not follow his Alice in wonderland logic) I asked politely he just excuse the recent absence in light of doctor note. He said "I can't that would be like excusing the future'. I didnt know how to go around that loop with him anymore, his voice was very acid and rude, and it was obvious he either has dyslexia and doesnt understand what it means to excuse an absence OR he is giving me a hard time. Later in summer he announced a meeting on my voicemail. I called to ask he make it another time, bc I could not make that time, and he said he would not reschedule, because "he had already scheduled" and then told me gladly that her dad (noncustodial parent) would be there, so it didnt matter if I was or not. Anyways, given any other person, I would assume of course they wont go to court, but this man has personal issues maybe from his own life that have made him take up my ex's cause. It seems like after the point where I told him I would rather not have him come home with me in my car, that things got ugly...i still remember when he asked me that, and I was shocked, thought he was joking, and then said I would rather not, his face got kind of red and he got quiet and said 'I dont know why you wouldnt want to..' and then it became very personal after that point. I guess I could have let him 'hop in my car and come home with me' but I didnt feel right about that. Can you imagine people seeing us drive in my car to my house? So, I said no thanks, but he acted as if I were obligated to do so and was very insulted. The thing I dont get also is that I asked a teacher from her old school at the same district if she would write a basic character reference for me, nothing involved, nothing against my ex, just a brief note about me, and she said policy forbids it. |
lexiesmom Member
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posted 09-21-2006 01:49 PM
As for policy, I think it depends on the individual school district, of course things may have changed since I was dealing with it. I know way back when, wow at least 10 years ago, two years after our divorce her father called to say he was suing for full custody. This after not seeing her in two years and not paying a dime of support. Nor had he attended her surgeries, speech therapy anything. And the first four years of having any disibilit are the ones filled with the most dr, speech, pt and all kinds of other appointments. Lex's teachers and speech therapists where more than happy to go to court as character witnesses. Not trying to scare you, just letting you know that a phone call to the dept of education will answer that question for you. Call them explain you are in the middle of a custody battle, and your ex has asked the principle to take the stand as a character witness, and you want to know if that is allowed. As for the principles conduct, I would be callling a little known resource for parents, a parent advocate. You can tell them what has happened, but you have to do it calmly and proffessionaly and explain that 1) your daughter stayed home because it was ordered by a doctor 2) there is no need for a male principal to get into a car of any parents, let alone a car of a single mother and daughter, that just opens a door open to him being accused of many things 3) there is also no need for a male principal to step foot into a single woman and childs home with out another witness there, even if for his own reputation and to protect him against allegations. If these problems persist you have rights and can take this to the department of education, you don't know how many other parents this has happened to that have not stepped up. They might if someone else does.
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sandra Member
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posted 09-21-2006 02:03 PM
lexiesmom,that is good input, thanks. I just mainly dont understand 2 things (I already understand the principal has issues and was out of line) but my 2 things I don't get are: 1) Why it would be against her old school's 'policy' for a teacher to jot down 5 or 6 sentences about my character, how I participated in her education. That is NOT biased, or being inappropriately involved,...it is just a teacher saying 'this parent attended the conferences, she got tutoring for her daughter, she was helpful. AMen' why is that a big deal? But, the teacher claims, and I recall this from years ago, that her boss, the principal at the school doesnt allow the teachers to do even that basic of a help. 2) If her old school has a policy against a teacher just stating this parent attended conferences, this parent was responsible, ....which is like bare bones, it's not hard to do, it doesnt involve even going to court, and doesn't show bias against the other parent, it's only a character reference for ME. So, if that school has a policy against even doing that little, how could the principal of this school (which is in the same district, and I assume falls under the same guidelines, policies, etc) be allowed to run down to court on the taxpayer dime, to live out his own fantasy or whatever in court? It just seems that it cannot be the case where 2 schools in the same district would have 2 opposite policies like that. It isnt just make up as you go along, there should be some actual set out policy. If the principal of this school can run to court so eagerly, for something so trivial, to live out his own agenda in court or whatever...then the teachers at her old school need to be allowed to at LEAST write a basic note stating how I am as a parent.
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lexiesmom Member
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posted 09-21-2006 02:49 PM
I am sure that the schools don't have different policies, that is why I think you really need to contact the district and find out legally what the policy is. And, I am assuming you have an attorney because of the court case, you need to let him in on what is happening at school and with your ex. He needs to know to fully do his job, and if he is not doing his job it might be time to find a new attorney. You are going to have to find out what the districts policies are or you are going to continue to stress over it which isn't going to do you or your daughter any good. I know it sucks, you don't know the background maybe the principal had a daughter he lost custody to or one of his freinds did and he is just bitter against women. Maybe your ex told him all kinds of things maybe his lawyer did. You just dont know. So you are going to have to cover yourself and find out the districts policies and then you are going to have to tlak to someone, your attorney or if he recommends the district itself and explain what he has been doing. i can assure there is not a superintendent around that would think it is ok for his school principal was suggesting going in your car or to your home alone. |